Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

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Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by PackerMan71 on Sun Oct 30, 2016 12:06 am

Seems like I'm not the only one who's given up on NASCAR.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by BJ Falcon on Sun Oct 30, 2016 12:37 am

I dropped off NASCAR back in 2010 and never followed it since. I mean, this sport is dying! People are beginning to steadily drift their attention from this to other sports personalities like Kevin Durant, Russell Westbrook, Russell Wilson, etc. This isn't looking too promising for this once-cherished sport. I used to enjoy it. I rejoiced when Dale Sr. won the 500 in 1998, three days before my birthday! Anytime people talked NASCAR on the radio in Missoula, there were peaks of interest which led to the National Guard and DeWalt show cars being sent to Missoula in separate years, both of which I saw. Sadly today, nobody in Griz Nation even cares about it. Tell anyone in MIssoula about it, they'd be like "Huh? What? Don't care" and just move on with watching crappy Thursday Night Football.

Thanks a lot NASCAR! You ruined our fandom!
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by Rovenami on Sun Oct 30, 2016 1:24 am

I may be an avid fan of the sport since 2004 or so...but when the executives behind NASCAR slip up, they do so in a BIG level to the point of losing a considerable amount of their fanbase and I do not blame the fans that left for doing so. It's a good thing that we have alternatives to NASCAR (For example, IndyCar and Formula 1).
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by Alta on Sun Oct 30, 2016 3:55 am

I was done after 2015, but came back because my personal life fell apart again i need excuses for escapism. But as we come up on the end of 2016 i'm starting to feel the whole "why do i watch this again."

The chase is a broken way to crown a champion, the drivers are unlikable with only a couple exceptions, the people running it are so disingenuous and downright scummy at points, the people reporting on the sport toe the company line, a large margin of the fanbase are absolute whiners or whine over stupid stuff.

Nascar is so disconnected for the motorsport world at large its ridiculous.

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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by Ben Atkins on Sun Oct 30, 2016 11:44 am

It's racing, so I'll watch it.

Sure, there's a shitty points system in place, and the racing can be monotonous but they're trying to fix the actual racing product by changing the aero package and stuff like that.

Seems like they've been trying to appeal to a more casual audience as of recent, and I understand why that would upset more hardcore fans like pretty much everyone on here, but honestly, can't blame them for trying.

Not every race is going to be a five-wide pack race with a photo finish and a car in the catchfence at the end, but a lot of the fanbase don't seem to understand that. Honestly, as far as the racing aspect goes, this year has been the best for a few years IMO.

I think I get why people are ready to give up on it, but at the end of the day, if it's on, I'll watch it.

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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by Tanrar on Sun Oct 30, 2016 12:07 pm

To the people that say you're "giving up on NASCAR", you know who you are:

Now, to actually weigh in on this issue. As much as I hate the current Chase system, NASCAR is trying to fix the product. Keyword in that sentence is trying. 2016 has been an improvement over the burning trash heap that was 2015. NASCAR is what I grew up with, and as such, I want to see it recover and be as fun to watch as it used to be. Motorsports in general has been in need of some good stuff lately as far as the big 3 goes. Indycar felt very ho-hum as the season progressed (controversial opinion: IndyCar Oval races > Indycar Road Races), and F1 is a two-driver parade up front. I know people say "There's more going on than what's at the front", but it seems like people instantly forget that when watching NASCAR. There are some people who can't let go that DEM GOD DAYUM JAPCRAP YODERS are in the field, and those people can kindly eat shit, but tl;dr, I still have hope for NASCAR, and I want to see NASCAR succeed again.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by NASCARLOVER427 on Sun Oct 30, 2016 1:16 pm

EXACTLY TANRAR. EXACTLY.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by PackerMan71 on Sun Oct 30, 2016 1:36 pm

Ben Atkins wrote:It's racing, so I'll watch it.

Sure, there's a shitty points system in place, and the racing can be monotonous but they're trying to fix the actual racing product by changing the aero package and stuff like that.

Seems like they've been trying to appeal to a more casual audience as of recent, and I understand why that would upset more hardcore fans like pretty much everyone on here, but honestly, can't blame them for trying.

Not every race is going to be a five-wide pack race with a photo finish and a car in the catchfence at the end, but a lot of the fanbase don't seem to understand that. Honestly, as far as the racing aspect goes, this year has been the best for a few years IMO.

I think I get why people are ready to give up on it, but at the end of the day, if it's on, I'll watch it.

I can understand why you have that mindset, but let me inject some points of my own.

From what I've heard the 2016 season has been miles better than the 2015 season in terms of how good the racing has been, and that's good. And yet, the ratings and attendance continue to drop. Why is that despite the improved racing, the audience continues to dwindle?

The answer is simple.

2015.

What a lot of people don't realize is that the 2015 season did a lot of damage to the sport. Let's count the ways.

1. The racing.

It was God-awful for a large majority of the season, stemmed from a dumbass aero package that NASCAR decided to implement instead of sticking with the 2014 package, which IMO produced some of the best racing on a consistent basis, and yet, they decided to change it for 2015, and it was a complete disaster. When I saw the Atlanta race and saw how shitty it was, I had a feeling that 215 was gonna suck a bucket of monkey ass, and it did. There were a few gems in 2015, but in comparison to the 2014 season, it was a night and day difference.

2. The constant rules and aero package changes.

I realize that NASCAR is trying to maintain balance throughout the field, but the problem is, when you change the rules that often, it gets way too confusing at times for fans, and casual viewers of the sport will look at that and go, 'Man, these guys can't make up their mind on what they want to do.' Not exactly the type of perception you want if you're trying to bring in new fans and win back old ones who left.

Also, changing the aero package twenty times to try to improve the racing doesn't help matters either, when all you had to do was go back to the 2014 package. Simple fix, really, but it seems like NASCAR wants to do things the complicated way. No And don't even get me started on the high drag package they tried at Indy and Michigan. Indy we kind of expected to be crap to begin with, but Michigan... oh, my God. Ragepuke Drool That race literally gave me a migraine headache, it was so bad. I thought it couldn't get any worse. I was wrong.

3. The Chase.

It's an abomination to the sport. And when they decided to go to the stick and ball style in 2014, several people on here was willing to give it a chance, but I saw how shitty this system was gonna be from a country mile away, and sure enough, the 2014 Chase proved me right on that one, the 2015 Chase even more so. Of course, it also didn't help when NASCAR decided to retain the original 2015 package for the Chase, and my interest in the sport was dwindling little by little. As the year went on, it was getting more and more difficult for me to muster any kind of excitement for these races. You know how long it took me to watch the Kansas race? The one where Logano wrecked Kenseth to win? The night before Talladega, nearly a full week after the fact. That's how long it took me to watch that race.

And then, of course, there's Talladega, the race where I finally gave up on the sport. Several people made the comment to me 'I can't believe you would stop watching NASCAR because of what happened at Talladega, because of the result of one race.' What those people need to realize is that Talladega wasn't the sole reason for my decision to stop watching. Look back at all the points I've made so far. The season was garbage, the constant rules changes were infuriating, the politics and dumb decisions from NASCAR, and the Chase. It was all one big snowball full of dog shit, and the cherry on top was the Talladega fiasco.

From NASCAR changing the rules of the GWC mid-race, to the fact that they decided on just one attempt (which I knew would end in disaster), and of course, Kevin Harvick wrecking Trevor Bayne and causing the Big One to basically save his championship hopes. His engine was failing, and he knew that if the race finished under green, he would finish back in the 30's and he would be out of the championship, so he decided to be a scumbag and cause an accident that he somehow manages to stay out of in spite of cars wrecking all around him, and he finishes 15th and moves on to the next round.

It was pretty clear what he did, and there was a shit ton of evidence against him, including the radio traffic with his crew chief, the on-board camera, the fact his engine was going south and the circumstances he would be in if the race went green, it was obvious he manipulated the Chase. In fact, I'd argue that there was more evidence against Harvick than there was against MWR, and looked what happened to them. They don't even exist anymore because of the sanctions they got and the subsequent fallout from it.

But it wasn't the race itself or what Harvick did that caused me to finally stop watching. The straw that broke the camel's back was the aftermath: NASCAR's complete unwillingness to do anything about Harvick. When I saw the tweet stating that there would be no penalties for Harvick, that's when I said 'I'm done' and I haven't watched since. I've looked up results and articles and things of that nature, but as far as me investing four hours of my time every Sunday into this sport, no more. Because I refuse to support a company that's this incompetent and doesn't even follow its own rules. Like for instance, this year at Talladega, the Gibbs cars all hung out at the back and pretty much stayed there the entire race. NASCAR said they were 'following a team strategy'. If that's the case, then tell me again, what's the point of the 100% rule if you're not gonna even enforce it?

This is what the Chase has done, and in addition to all that, it makes all the races meaningless, because the points don't mean jack shit anymore, and the races don't mean anything toward the championship anymore. Only one race matters now, and that's Homestead, because that's where the championship is decided. So... what's the point in watching the rest of the races? (shrug)

Also, for the people who still do the 'See You In Daytona' meme bullshit, a couple of things. First off, that meme was relevant in 2008. Not so much in 2016, and I'm about to tell you why with a little fun fact.

You know how many people watched the 2006 Daytona 500?

19.4 million viewers. That's a lot of fucking people. Shocked To this day, it remains the most-watched Daytona 500 in history.

How many people watched the Daytona 500 this year?

11.4 million people. Nearly half of the total from 2006, a full 8 million fewer viewers than 2006. So... where did all of those viewers go? (shrug)

That's pretty much all I have to say on the matter. Sorry for the giant paragraphs, but I had a lot to say on this matter, and now that it's off my chest, I feel better.

Will I ever return to watching NASCAR again? Only if one monumental decision happens...

NASCAR gets rid of the Chase. That would be a cause for celebration.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by kensethfan on Sun Oct 30, 2016 1:44 pm

Packer, for someone who "gave up" on NASCAR, you sure seem to get off on complaining about it.

Ditto what Ben and Tanner said.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by Lucstar88 on Sun Oct 30, 2016 1:56 pm

The NFL is also at it's worst ratings since 2006.

Walking Dead went from 7.4 to 2.6 MILLION VIEWERS in one season.

WWE's ratings are also down by 3 million.

ESPN lost 621,000 subscribers this month, the worst in history

I get bashing NASCAR on some things, but 95% of the comments i see on FB or Reddit or Twitter make my head hurt.

NASCAR needs to embrace social media. TV viewers aren't the end all be all. They never like being wrong, so that's why i'll never see the chase leaving.

I'll still watch it, I got nothing better to due on weekends. I love the truck series, way more then the other 2.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by BJ Falcon on Sun Oct 30, 2016 1:58 pm

I'm so glad I didn't watch the 2015 season. The way I see it, unless something monumental like the extermination of the stick-and-ball version of the Chase, or rather, the Chase altogether happens to take shape, sorry. I'm staying with my choice I made a few years ago and not even touch NASCAR with a 39 1/2 foot pole. I just have no hope for what 2017 will be for this once-cherished sport based on the facts Packer pointed out. No hope for it. NASCAR to me is just like the election. I. Don't. Care. If NASCAR can just stop making shitty changes that makes them look like complete jackasses with their heads cut off, maybe, just maybe, I'll be more in tune to watch a few races here and there. But until then, forget you, NASCAR. You're nothing to me now.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by Lucstar88 on Sun Oct 30, 2016 2:07 pm

BJ Falcon wrote: But until then, forget you, NASCAR. You're nothing to me now.

I'm pretty sure NASCAR really takes that to heart. Rolling Eyes

If you really want to make a statement, it's with your wallet, don't watch, go to races, even talk about it (speading the word). No matter how much fans complain, it's not gonna change, look at the NFL and their stupid rules, they've ADDED even with fan backlash.

Unless you're in the NASCAR leadership group, you can't change a thing. I know it sucks but that's the world sadly Sad
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by BJ Falcon on Sun Oct 30, 2016 2:21 pm

Hey. That's fine by me. There are others that I personally can change. Not any of us can really change what NASCAR does, really any sports organization for that matter to be quite honest despite how much we don't like it. We can only change what we CAN change within ourselves. You'd think we'd have the ability to change NASCAR's ways, but, in reality, we don't.

I can't agree with the "it's in your wallet" statement because there are other factors to choosing to watch a race, see it live or not than just money.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by Rovenami on Sun Oct 30, 2016 2:24 pm

PackerMan71 wrote:

From NASCAR changing the rules of the GWC mid-race, to the fact that they decided on just one attempt (which I knew would end in disaster), and of course, Kevin Harvick wrecking Trevor Bayne and causing the Big One to basically save his championship hopes. His engine was failing, and he knew that if the race finished under green, he would finish back in the 30's and he would be out of the championship, so he decided to be a scumbag and cause an accident that he somehow manages to stay out of in spite of cars wrecking all around him, and he finishes 15th and moves on to the next round.

It was pretty clear what he did, and there was a shit ton of evidence against him, including the radio traffic with his crew chief, the on-board camera, the fact his engine was going south and the circumstances he would be in if the race went green, it was obvious he manipulated the Chase. In fact, I'd argue that there was more evidence against Harvick than there was against MWR, and looked what happened to them. They don't even exist anymore because of the sanctions they got and the subsequent fallout from it.

But it wasn't the race itself or what Harvick did that caused me to finally stop watching. The straw that broke the camel's back was the aftermath: NASCAR's complete unwillingness to do anything about Harvick. When I saw the tweet stating that there would be no penalties for Harvick, that's when I said 'I'm done' and I haven't watched since. I've looked up results and articles and things of that nature, but as far as me investing four hours of my time every Sunday into this sport, no more. Because I refuse to support a company that's this incompetent and doesn't even follow its own rules. Like for instance, this year at Talladega, the Gibbs cars all hung out at the back and pretty much stayed there the entire race. NASCAR said they were 'following a team strategy'. If that's the case, then tell me again, what's the point of the 100% rule if you're not gonna even enforce it?


It also didn't help that the very next race, Kenseth vs Logano occurred. So while Kenseth's actions warranted a huge penalty, apparently it doesn't count when Harvick did an identical move. Regardless of how one thinks of the drivers in question, it shows how inconsistent the higher ups at the sport are at handling penalties.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by Lucstar88 on Sun Oct 30, 2016 2:37 pm

BJ Falcon wrote:I can't agree with the "it's in your wallet" statement because there are other factors to choosing to watch a race, see it live or not than just money.

Well, if you don't watch, that means less eyes on the sponsors of the sport, which means they would think their money can be well spent elsewhere, which means, no $$$ for NASCAR, and it goes downhill from that, not including TV deals.

Everything has a $$$ effect. Just because you don't actually *pay* for it, doesn't mean it doesn't have a effect.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by kensethfan on Sun Oct 30, 2016 3:24 pm

I'm sorry, but I can't be alone in thinking this is a stupid argument.

If you watch NASCAR, that's fine. If you don't, that's fine too. But for Christ's sake, quit complaining about it if you don't watch.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by Casey Lester on Sun Oct 30, 2016 5:06 pm

kensethfan wrote:Packer, for someone who "gave up" on NASCAR, you sure seem to get off on complaining about it.

Agreed.

Lucstar88 wrote:If you really want to make a statement, it's with your wallet, don't watch, go to races, even talk about it (speading the word).

Also agreed.

Rovenami wrote:Regardless of how one thinks of the drivers in question, it shows how inconsistent the higher ups at the sport are at handling penalties.

Very much agreed.

I have my discrepancies with the "stick-and-ball" Chase format, the godawful season that was 2015, the inconsistency of officiating, the shitty aero package, etc. but the reality of the situation is that attention is positive feedback aka a ratings boost to NASCAR and they interpret that as an incentive to keep doing what they're doing. Simply put, if you do not like the product, do not watch it. I'm guilty of this as well (Xfinity namely), but if people stop watching, NASCAR will eventually listen to their audience to find out what to improve on.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by PRAWBLEMS on Sun Oct 30, 2016 5:17 pm

I think this season, on a whole, has been much better than 2015, and I expect 2017 to be an improvement as well. That being said, NASCAR as a sanctioning body sucks. No question, no ifs, ands or buts. I actually liked the new Chase format, and executed well it could be a success, but with BS like that caution today NASCAR keeps digging itself into a hole.
That being said, people's "solutions" are absolutely ridiculous. They basically boil down to eliminate the Chase, make rules against strategic driving, and basically make it 1967 again. 1967 worked then, 2016 needs work, but it doesn't need Petty/Johnson winning by 9 laps with 22 cars entered. It needs real work, more, I feel, than NASCAR higher-ups want to put in right now. But it's still my favorite sport since I was a little kid, and the alternatives still have their own problems.
Tl;dr It's got problems but some "fans" have dumb ideas and really aren't helping the situation.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by RetrogradeRenegade on Sun Oct 30, 2016 6:09 pm

I'll always come back around to watching NASCAR. I won't watch it week-in week-out religiously, but I'll have it on in the background.

That said, I've lost a huge amount of respect for the sport and for what the championship represents, firstly because of the Chase, and secondly because Kevin Harvick is the biggest scumbag motorsport has ever seen (that I know of).
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by NASCARLOVER427 on Sun Oct 30, 2016 7:56 pm

I actually find the 2014 chase system alright other than the "win and you're in" thing, just the top 16 in points duking it out, like normal stick and ball playoffs.

I think it can work, but stick and ball "points systems" are much more simplistic. Just 2 teams and a binary win/loss. In motorsports there are anywhere from 8 to about 50 on track at once, which is why there is points systems. I think what happened is that Brian France, the imbecile he is, looked at the NFL website and saw the win/loss record was what got teams into the playoffs and thought that it was because of the wins., so that's where the "win and you're in" mentality comes from, which is not subjectively true because as I said, most motorsports are not that simple.
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Re: Former Fans of NASCAR Sounding Off On The Sport

Post by BooyakaDragon on Fri Nov 04, 2016 6:35 am

shrug

I just like watching race cars go around in a circle (and sometimes right, which are always fun). It would take a lot to get me to stop watching, as oval racing as a whole is a personal enjoyment to watch. The cars definitely need to get better, but they're working toward it. Gordon retiring wasn't enough to get me to stop watching, so at this point something drastic would need to take place. I've been watching since I was like 2 years old, and it's my personal enjoyments for weekends.

-I think the fandom needs a serious "reboot", which is pretty much impossible.

-I can live with the Chase.

-The caution clock is...well....something that I'd rather see go away and never come back

-While Brian France is a very questionable leader, I do think he's trying. You don't make decisions without some kind of valid reasoning in your head. I'd rather have someone else like 99% of the fan base, but unless some kind of coup d'etat occurs, then we're stuck with him.
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