Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Ceej on Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:34 am

Bring on the Modifieds and Trucks. Fuck the Big 2 Divisions. The Australian GP is when? March 16? Thanks.
I'm out. NASCAR's officially no more valid to me as a sports entity than the WWE.

I have trouble believing these statements. Anyone who I've seen declare "I'm never watching NASCAR again" always gets sucked back in.

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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Magus978 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:54 am

Ceej wrote:
Bring on the Modifieds and Trucks. Fuck the Big 2 Divisions. The Australian GP is when? March 16? Thanks.
I'm out. NASCAR's officially no more valid to me as a sports entity than the WWE.

I have trouble believing these statements. Anyone who I've seen declare "I'm never watching NASCAR again" always gets sucked back in.

This. When you're a racing fan, you'll watch just about any kind of racing. If Sprint Cup or Nationwide were the only games in town this week, pretty sure at least half of the "I'm done" crowd would watch out of desperation.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Tanrar on Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:00 am

Ceej wrote:
Bring on the Modifieds and Trucks. Fuck the Big 2 Divisions. The Australian GP is when? March 16? Thanks.
I'm out. NASCAR's officially no more valid to me as a sports entity than the WWE.

I have trouble believing these statements. Anyone who I've seen declare "I'm never watching NASCAR again" always gets sucked back in.

I know where you're coming from. But I do have a logical theory as to why this is: If you've grown up watching NASCAR, no matter how stupid things get, no matter what they do that pisses you off, you find yourself unable to kick it entirely. Your tastes may change as time goes on, but more often than not, You find yourself coming back to NASCAR because it has a fond place in your memories. Memories of growing up and seeing the likes of Jeff Gordon, Rusty Wallace, Dale Earnhardt, Dale Jarrett, Bobby Labonte, etc. battling it out every week for the Winston Cup Title. Memories of seeing humble beginnings and bitter ends, seeing the rise of a new generation, and the slow end of an era. It's a feeling that's hard to explain for someone like me, Someone can probably sum it up better than I can, But what I'm trying to say, I suppose, is that if you've been around a series long enough, it's much harder to stop watching than something you just started watching.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Cardinals5 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 11:51 am

Ceej wrote:
Bring on the Modifieds and Trucks. Fuck the Big 2 Divisions. The Australian GP is when? March 16? Thanks.
I'm out. NASCAR's officially no more valid to me as a sports entity than the WWE.

I have trouble believing these statements. Anyone who I've seen declare "I'm never watching NASCAR again" always gets sucked back in.

That's fine, I get why you feel that way and if I weren't the one making the statement, I'd probably feel the same as you.

However, why should my money go to a sport that ignores the wishes of its fans? Why should I support them through TV viewership, buying their products or attending a race when the fans clearly don't matter? All that matters to NASCAR/Brian France is being "better" than the NFL, which is idiotic and impossible to do. The only thing they really did in the past decade that could be considered "for the fans" was the Gen6, and that was really because the manufacturers insisted on it.

If they cared about racing, they'd improve the racing. They care about drama and "ratings", so they're improving the "product". That's the main reason I'm done with them. I can't see any reason to follow a racing series that cares more about its "entertainment value" than its actual racing.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by PYLrulz on Fri Jan 31, 2014 2:50 pm

Magus978 wrote:
Ceej wrote:
Bring on the Modifieds and Trucks. Fuck the Big 2 Divisions. The Australian GP is when? March 16? Thanks.
I'm out. NASCAR's officially no more valid to me as a sports entity than the WWE.

I have trouble believing these statements. Anyone who I've seen declare "I'm never watching NASCAR again" always gets sucked back in.

This. When you're a racing fan, you'll watch just about any kind of racing. If Sprint Cup or Nationwide were the only games in town this week, pretty sure at least half of the "I'm done" crowd would watch out of desperation.

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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Cynon on Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:17 pm

Cardinals5 wrote:If they cared about racing, they'd improve the racing. They care about drama and "ratings", so they're improving the "product". That's the main reason I'm done with them. I can't see any reason to follow a racing series that cares more about its "entertainment value" than its actual racing.

Improving the on-track racing takes more money than throwing a few shitty gimmicks around and hoping they'll work. Honestly, the new chase format killed most of my general excitement at all the rookie talent (and rookie "talent") coming to Sprint Cup.

Excitement can't be generated, it has to happen naturally. Forcing a "Game 7 moment" is NASCAR's way of saying that they're giving up on their on-track product.

Maybe I'm wrong, and excitement can be generated -- there are still a lot of easily impressed people out there who love super speedway racing.

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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by RACECAR on Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:24 pm

Well it looks like Qualifying will be the most exciting thing to watch in Cup, otherwise I really don't care anymore. I completely missed the chase in 2012 and almost did the same last year but I'm basically skipping the entire cup season. I don't even care that the 3 car is back and that we actually have a list of drivers for ROTY (as opposed to two drivers made of mediocore talent, usually of the ride buying type), it means nothing under this useless bullshit.

As fuming as I was at the TUSC, they are new and still have yet to complete a full season so they have room to improve. A series as old as the Cup series has no excuse for all these gimmicks.  

flyingturns89 wrote:The saddest thing is, NASCAR decided to make this monstrosity of a Chase instead of figuring out a way to stop Kyle Busch and the other Cuppies from winning 25 races a year in Nationwide.

Cup sucks at this point anyway so who cares? It means nothing now so honestly, I kinda don't mind them being in that series since they actually race in that (as well as the Trucks). Cup isn't racing anymore, its a parade/sports entertainment circus that merely parodies racing.


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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by f1fan12 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:36 pm

This season is gonna be fun!

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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Lucstar88 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:45 pm

1. People actually think after a win teams will lag off, well, then the sponsor would be livid not seeing their car in the top 5 all day cause they decided to lay off for the chase! Sponsor would pull out if for example Kyle Busch after winning at Phoenix, would finish 20th all year, M&M's would be furious.

2. I'm not in favor of this but i'll still watch since I love RACING!!! It could bring more interest at races like Richmond, right before the Chase, even Talladega, because it's the cut-off race in the chase, and it would bring excitement. Some may argue they would be racing without their brains, but it's the Cup Series, not ARCA...

3. For those who say "I'm NEVER WATCHING NASCAR AGAIN", NASCAR is like a drug, you can't just say i'm done, 3/4 of the people who are saying that will likely watch the Daytona 500....  Neutral 

I'll let one season go though, to see what happens.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Magus978 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:48 pm

PYLrulz wrote:
Magus978 wrote:
Ceej wrote:
Bring on the Modifieds and Trucks. Fuck the Big 2 Divisions. The Australian GP is when? March 16? Thanks.
I'm out. NASCAR's officially no more valid to me as a sports entity than the WWE.

I have trouble believing these statements. Anyone who I've seen declare "I'm never watching NASCAR again" always gets sucked back in.

This. When you're a racing fan, you'll watch just about any kind of racing. If Sprint Cup or Nationwide were the only games in town this week, pretty sure at least half of the "I'm done" crowd would watch out of desperation.


Okay, see you at the 500 then Razz

We all know you'll text me if something crazy happens, looking for my reaction Very Happy
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by day500champ1 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 8:45 pm

Initially, I liked the Chase, though I loved Matt winning it all in '03.  But about 2007, it lost its excitement.  It wasn't till 2010 and 2011 that it really was good.  Both of those Chases were worth watching (despite JJ winning in 2010).

The problem with the Chase for me is that what was meant to be or produce close title fights and it did the exact opposite (2004 and 2011 being the exceptions).

I'll give this system (if they stick with it) 2 years before I really judge it.

As far as the "I'm leaving NASCAR" crowd, let's be honest here. 9 out of every 10 people who say that say it cause a driver they don't like is dominating (i.e. Johnson, Busch, etc.).  I once considered not wacthing anymore but I am first and formost a NASCAR fan and still continue to wacth regardless.  Though I have started not watching any of the JJ post race stuff.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by PYLrulz on Fri Jan 31, 2014 11:59 pm

Magus978 wrote:
PYLrulz wrote:
Magus978 wrote:
Ceej wrote:
Bring on the Modifieds and Trucks. Fuck the Big 2 Divisions. The Australian GP is when? March 16? Thanks.
I'm out. NASCAR's officially no more valid to me as a sports entity than the WWE.

I have trouble believing these statements. Anyone who I've seen declare "I'm never watching NASCAR again" always gets sucked back in.

This. When you're a racing fan, you'll watch just about any kind of racing. If Sprint Cup or Nationwide were the only games in town this week, pretty sure at least half of the "I'm done" crowd would watch out of desperation.


Okay, see you at the 500 then Razz

We all know you'll text me if something crazy happens, looking for my reaction Very Happy

Trust me, I ain't watching again. Maybe youtube clips if something crazy happens, but that's the furthest I will watch.

I've defended NASCAR with some of their decisions, and let them have passes on others, but doing this to the Chase... sorry, I'm gone from NASCAR
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Sparkz47 on Sat Feb 01, 2014 1:01 am

day500champ1 wrote:As far as the "I'm leaving NASCAR" crowd, let's be honest here. 9 out of every 10 people who say that say it cause a driver they don't like is dominating (i.e. Johnson, Busch, etc.).  I once considered not wacthing anymore but I am first and formost a NASCAR fan and still continue to wacth regardless.  Though I have started not watching any of the JJ post race stuff.

Leaving NASCAR and watching NASCAR are two separate things. I'll probably still watch it occasionally, if for nothing but curiosity, but my heart won't be in it. I won't be buying any of the merchandise. I won't be hanging on every lap. I won't be going to any of the races. I'll flip on the channel, see how many miles the leader is winning by, or how many tens of people have shown up to watch all two championship contenders, and promptly direct my attention to the IndyCar race. NASCAR has lost me as a fan. Gone are the days where I would cheer for my favorite driver with all my might, the days of true competition and passion, the days of real NASCAR.

So, will I keep watching NASCAR? Probably. But will I be a NASCAR fan? Not a chance.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by RetrogradeRenegade on Sat Feb 01, 2014 1:37 am

I'm done with NASCAR. I was willing to get back into it last year, but if they can't take themselves seriously any more then I won't either. Like Sparkz, I might tune in occasionally but I won't really care.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Nascar9fan on Sat Feb 01, 2014 1:46 am

Honestly, watching ARLA, TM Master Cup etc. that this site produces made me become more interested in NASCAR, but I've never been a huge fan, since I started watching during Jimmie's win streak. I don't even watch any race to begin with. The ONLY race I've ever watched in its entirety was the 2010 Coke Zero 400, & I watched it because I was ill. I only ever cared about 2 things in this sport, who won & who lost. Everything else ment nothing to me, but with stuff like this stupid points system, even that won't be interesting anymore. Just glad I grew up watching V8's, F1, Indycar, & the lower tier Australian racing series', the ones that actually reward racing
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by SpeedDemon37 on Sat Feb 01, 2014 1:25 pm

PYLrulz wrote:People might complain that a points race can get boring if someone runs away with it, but if the 36 or 20 or 25 or however many races you run are usually fun to watch, the boring points races become a minor issue, if that, because it's hidden behind fun exciting action.
Cynon wrote:Excitement can't be generated, it has to happen naturally. Forcing a "Game 7 moment" is NASCAR's way of saying that they're giving up on their on-track product.
My ideas have basically been summed up here. As long as the racing is enjoyable to watch, a boring championship fight is something that we can (or at least, should be able to) live with.

My uncle is a huge NASCAR fan who taped most evey race for years, but he quit following the sport a few years ago. Unlike him, I could probably never entirely stop paying attention to NASCAR if I tried, but I, too, will not care to pay close attention to every race like I used to if I can help it. I actually haven't watched a Cup race on TV since Martinsville last fall. Without Mark Martin racing at all anymore, that's just another lost reason, albeit a more personal one, for me to follow the Cup Series.

My family's already planning on going to the ARCA race at Berlin Raceway instead of MIS this year. It's a shame really, because having spent a race weekend at MIS, I felt that the speedway did an exceptional job at providing an enjoyable experience for all of their fans. The only thing that wasn't entirely satisfying was what they couldn't control; the the racing product of the cars.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by PYLrulz on Sat Feb 01, 2014 6:56 pm

SpeedDemon37 wrote:
PYLrulz wrote:People might complain that a points race can get boring if someone runs away with it, but if the 36 or 20 or 25 or however many races you run are usually fun to watch, the boring points races become a minor issue, if that, because it's hidden behind fun exciting action.
Cynon wrote:Excitement can't be generated, it has to happen naturally. Forcing a "Game 7 moment" is NASCAR's way of saying that they're giving up on their on-track product.
My ideas have basically been summed up here. As long as the racing is enjoyable to watch, a boring championship fight is something that we can (or at least, should be able to) live with.

My uncle is a huge NASCAR fan who taped most evey race for years, but he quit following the sport a few years ago. Unlike him, I could probably never entirely stop paying attention to NASCAR if I tried, but I, too, will not care to pay close attention to every race like I used to if I can help it. I actually haven't watched a Cup race on TV since Martinsville last fall. Without Mark Martin racing at all anymore, that's just another lost reason, albeit a more personal one, for me to follow the Cup Series.

My family's already planning on going to the ARCA race at Berlin Raceway instead of MIS this year. It's a shame really, because having spent a race weekend at MIS, I felt that the speedway did an exceptional job at providing an enjoyable experience for all of their fans. The only thing that wasn't entirely satisfying was what they couldn't control; the the racing product of the cars.

I went to Pocono for my first Cup race last year. Same as you, it was a fun experience, but if NASCAR just keeps on doing what they are doing instead of simply working on the cars so they can provide a good race without throwing in a cheap gimmick, it will be the only Cup race I will ever attend.

If Brian France somehow goes aboutface and gets it, or something happens, new leadership comes in, and they get it, and fix up the product, I cannot watch another NASCAR race anymore. I just can't, and I had been one, like I said earlier, that had defended some NASCAR decisions, and was able to look past other decisions.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Alpineopossum on Sat Feb 01, 2014 7:30 pm

If this system had been in place in 2013, Dale Earnhardt Jr. would have been champion.

That's why they did it.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by vbooy57 on Sat Feb 01, 2014 7:36 pm

Alpineopossum wrote:If this system had been in place in 2013, Dale Earnhardt Jr. would have been champion.

That's why they did it.
That's what I was thinking.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by PackerMan71 on Sat Feb 01, 2014 8:32 pm

Alpineopossum wrote:If this system had been in place in 2013, Dale Earnhardt Jr. would have been champion.

That's why they did it.

You can't be serious.  Shocked 
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by bsoyuz on Sat Feb 01, 2014 8:35 pm

PackerMan71 wrote:
Alpineopossum wrote:If this system had been in place in 2013, Dale Earnhardt Jr. would have been champion.

That's why they did it.

You can't be serious.  Shocked 

Here's your proof:



from NASCARnomics
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by PackerMan71 on Sat Feb 01, 2014 8:42 pm

bsoyuz wrote:
PackerMan71 wrote:
Alpineopossum wrote:If this system had been in place in 2013, Dale Earnhardt Jr. would have been champion.

That's why they did it.

You can't be serious.  Shocked 

Here's your proof:



from NASCARnomics

.......................

I think my brain just collapsed on itself.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Cynon on Sat Feb 01, 2014 8:51 pm

Nascar9fan wrote:Honestly, watching ARLA, TM Master Cup etc. that this site produces made me become more interested in NASCAR, but I've never been a huge fan, since I started watching during Jimmie's win streak. I don't even watch any race to begin with. The ONLY race I've ever watched in its entirety was the 2010 Coke Zero 400, & I watched it because I was ill. I only ever cared about 2 things in this sport, who won & who lost. Everything else ment nothing to me, but with stuff like this stupid points system, even that won't be interesting anymore. Just glad I grew up watching V8's, F1, Indycar, & the lower tier Australian racing series', the ones that actually reward racing

Go watch some old NASCAR races on Youtube -- and when I mean old, I don't mean 2006, I mean 1987-2003. Back in the days when broadcasters put on-board cameras on backmarkers just so they could get an onboard camera shot of anyone who wrecked in the back.

Seriously, you won't hate yourself and you'll feel clean after doing so. Just avoid highlights videos. Very Happy

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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Alpineopossum on Sat Feb 01, 2014 10:36 pm

PackerMan71 wrote:
Alpineopossum wrote:If this system had been in place in 2013, Dale Earnhardt Jr. would have been champion.

That's why they did it.

You can't be serious.  Shocked 

That was intended as a joke.

BTW: I love how Harry Gant would be a three time champion under this system.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by PackerMan71 on Sat Feb 01, 2014 11:59 pm

Alpineopossum wrote:
PackerMan71 wrote:
Alpineopossum wrote:If this system had been in place in 2013, Dale Earnhardt Jr. would have been champion.

That's why they did it.

You can't be serious.  Shocked 

That was intended as a joke.

BTW: I love how Harry Gant would be a three time champion under this system.

I was astonished at the Dale Jr. as a champion bit. I know they didn't put this system in place because of that.  Laughing 
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by SpeedDemon37 on Sun Feb 02, 2014 12:10 am

Kensth and Johnson had over a dozen wins between them last season, but Earnhardt, Jr. would have been the champion with zero victories...

I would love it if something like that were to happen this year, as it would show how wrong NASCAR is in saying that you need to win races to win the Chase. It nearly happened in 2011, with Carl Edwards and Tony Stewart scoring the same number of points even though Edwards won a single Chase race and Stewart won 5. If Edwards hadn't won that single race and Stewart had finished only one position worse in each of the 5 races that he didn't win, Edwards could've beat Stewart with no victories at all.

Also, I can hardly comprehend how hilarious this statement is.
Brian France wrote:We have arrived at a format that makes every race matter even more, diminishes points racing, puts a premium on winning races and concludes with a best-of-the-best, first-to-the-finish line showdown race – all of which is exactly what fans want. We have looked at a number of concepts for the last three years through fan research, models and simulations, and also maintained extensive dialogue with our drivers, teams and partners. The new Chase for the NASCAR Sprint Cup will be thrilling, easy to understand and help drive our sport’s competition to a whole new level.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by PackerMan71 on Sun Feb 02, 2014 12:57 am

Brian France wrote:We have arrived at a format that makes every race matter even more, diminishes points racing, puts a premium on winning races and concludes with a best-of-the-best, first-to-the-finish line showdown race – all of which is exactly what fans want. We have looked at a number of concepts for the last three years through fan research, models and simulations, and also maintained extensive dialogue with our drivers, teams and partners. The new Chase for the NASCAR Sprint Cup will be thrilling, easy to understand and help drive our sport’s competition to a whole new level.

 Ragepuke Ragepuke Ragepuke 
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by PYLrulz on Sun Feb 02, 2014 4:43 am

PackerMan71 wrote:
Brian France wrote:We have arrived at a format that makes every race matter even more, diminishes points racing, puts a premium on winning races and concludes with a best-of-the-best, first-to-the-finish line showdown race – all of which is exactly what fans want. We have looked at a number of concepts for the last three years through fan research, models and simulations, and also maintained extensive dialogue with our drivers, teams and partners. The new Chase for the NASCAR Sprint Cup will be thrilling, easy to understand and help drive our sport’s competition to a whole new level.

 Ragepuke Ragepuke Ragepuke 

If you want winning to be all important, then only count the wins. Screw 2nd place. Screw 10th place. Just count the wins.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Michael29Shell on Sun Feb 02, 2014 5:36 pm

http://beyondtheflag.com/2014/02/01/nascar-chase-changes-2014/
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by Sparkz47 on Sun Feb 02, 2014 5:41 pm

PackerMan71 wrote:
Brian France wrote:We have arrived at a format that makes every race matter even more, diminishes points racing, puts a premium on winning races and concludes with a best-of-the-best, first-to-the-finish line showdown race – all of which is exactly what fans want. We have looked at a number of concepts for the last three years through fan research, models and simulations, and also maintained extensive dialogue with our drivers, teams and partners. The new Chase for the NASCAR Sprint Cup will be thrilling, easy to understand and help drive our sport’s competition to a whole new level.

 Ragepuke Ragepuke Ragepuke 

Everything this man says sounds like he's a smooth-talking super villain giving a speech to his now-enslaved populace.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by PackerMan71 on Sun Feb 02, 2014 6:00 pm

bigdc48 wrote:
BWardboy88 wrote:
Alta wrote:
BWardboy88 wrote:I know if you guys don't like the new Knockout Chase Format, but the way you're all reacting isn't really on. I honestly think this could spice things up a little bit for the Cup Series, it's not like they're trying to copy all other American Ball Sports, they're probably trying to make it more competitive, and so other drivers who've probably not made the chase before could maybe use this as their best opportunity.
You are an expert at sarcasm sir lol.

I wasn't though, I was actually being serious. People who whine about this new system makes the situation worse than it needs to be.

I agree. I'm willing to give this a chance. Let's not make this format look like this is the beginning of the end.

I'm sorry, but I can't agree with this statement. All NASCAR is trying to do is cater to the non-NASCAR fans. Problem is, they're not NASCAR fans for a reason and they will continue to stay that way, while long time fans will join them in not watching anymore.

Sorry to break it to you, but this format might just signal the beginning of the end for NASCAR if they don't ax it ASAP. Judging by the widespread negative reaction, I'd say it's already begun.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

Post by RACECAR on Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:19 am

Brian France wrote:We have arrived at a format that makes every race matter even more, diminishes points racing, puts a premium on winning races and concludes with a best-of-the-best, first-to-the-finish line showdown race – all of which is exactly what fans want. We have looked at a number of concepts for the last three years through fan research, models and simulations, and also maintained extensive dialogue with our drivers, teams and partners. The new Chase for the NASCAR Sprint Cup will be thrilling, easy to understand and help drive our sport’s competition to a whole new level.


If I didn't know better, I'd say NASCAR is being run by yet another smooth talking politician.
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Re: Nascar looking to overhaul Points chase

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